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mystery-mark
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Posted: 02-12-2007 06:59 |
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Hi there MVDers!
I found out there are many members (actually most of the members) who are messing up with the words 'impromptu' and 'gimmicked' all of the time.
As far as I found the definitions of these words:
"Impromptu": Spoken, performed, done, or composed with (little or) no preparation.
"Gimmicked": A device employed to cheat, deceive, or trick, especially a mechanism for the secret and dishonest control of gambling apparatus.
This is also what I learnt when I started with doing magic.
It means you can have effects that are gimmicked but impromptu at the same time...
For example take a 'Marked Deck'. It's ready for use so for the magicians it doesn't take any preparation any more and to perform it it's impromptu. But it is a gimmick at the same time.
I know the definitions have been very vague for all of the time so I hope you now got it.
Discuss things over here for when you disagree with what I said...
Thanx for taking your time reading this thread!!Last edited on 02-12-2007 07:01 by
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millerwood
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Posted: 02-12-2007 23:21 |
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| I say it is gimmicked if the the gimmick is unseen or camo.
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e2x2e
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Posted: 02-13-2007 00:50 |
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Gimmicked: A routine in which an object or multiple objects are used to create the effect which are hidden from the audiences view during the routine.
Impromptu: All objects used to acomplish the effect are visible and appear to be used in a normal fashion throught the entire routine.
Thats what I call gimmicked and impromptu.
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DWood
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Posted: 02-13-2007 01:25 |
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e2x2e wrote: Gimmicked: A routine in which an object or multiple objects are used to create the effect which are hidden from the audiences view during the routine.
Impromptu: All objects used to acomplish the effect are visible and appear to be used in a normal fashion throught the entire routine.
Thats what I call gimmicked and impromptu.
All have to say, Do you think the layman cares??? I don;t think so!!! It's all about entertainment and getting payed!!! Sorry!!!
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magicmania
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Posted: 02-13-2007 01:42 |
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| I have to agree with Don. What was the point of this thread? (Don't tell me it was to clarify the meanings of the two words)
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mystery-mark
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Posted: 02-13-2007 06:57 |
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Last week there were two vids uploaded where members had a discussion about the meaning of these words so actually: Yes, this is to clarify the meanings yes...
But thanx for taking your time and for the posts!
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gone
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Posted: 02-13-2007 08:40 |
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| Impromptu simply means done without being planned, organized or rehearsed. You can do an impromtu effect and still use a gimmick. You can stick a fork in a bun and do an impromtu zombie ball effect under a napkin. Your gimmick is the fork. This is a good post I think many people are under the impression that an impomtu effect would not use a gimmick. But impromtu simply means unplanned and a gimmick is anything that helps you perform your effect but stays hidden from the audience.
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mystery-mark
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Posted: 02-16-2007 07:39 |
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That's a great post Boqin! Thanx!
Some questions:
-If you have a regular deck and during the performance you think of making a sidemark on it and you go on with the performance and doing a trick using the mark. It wasn't planned before so you would say it's impromptu don't you? But what if use that same deck for the next performance either with being planned? It's exactly the same effect and so I think it can't be impromptu only the first time can it?
-Does this mean all of the videos over here can not contain any impromptu magic untill it was a live performance of something you never tried before and you can see it wasn't planned before? All of the tricks over here were planned... While, sometimes some moves weren't but then only a part of the effect was impromptu...
Thanx for the post and please try to answer these questions!
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kyle007
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Posted: 02-16-2007 15:40 |
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| Mark I don't think I understand you haha of course the videos on here are planned or else there wouldn't be videos right? and I'll double check after but I believe the meaning of impromptu is without preparation so as long as the effect being performed can be done with no preparation whatsoever (ACR for example) then it's an impromptu effect regardless if you plan to do it or not.Sorry if I misunderstood your post or anything.
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mystery-mark
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Posted: 02-16-2007 18:03 |
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Lol Kyle! Maybe if you re-read all post it could help?
If not:
I think the way people use the words 'impromptu' and 'gimmicked' over here is a bit vague. People are calling effects 'impromptu' while they mean 'ungimmicked', etcetera. I want to make clear there are effects that can be 'impromptu' and 'gimmicked' at the same time and what the exact meanings of these words are for me and I'm asking you guys what the words mean for you or if you agree with my definitions (see the top post).
Boqin noticed something very important and so I ask him what he exactly meant...Last edited on 02-16-2007 18:04 by
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erlandish
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Posted: 02-16-2007 18:14 |
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My two cents... If I throw you my deck of cards and say "Show me something", any trick you can perform right there on the spot is impromptu. It's not even just about gimmicks... it's also about being able to work FASDIU (or being able to set up unsuspiciously) and with the environment and angles in question.
This is an important consideration. If, as a magician, I'm shopping for something new and something says it's an impromptu trick, but when I buy it, it says that I need to carry my TT with me, then I'm going to feel cheated. Of course a gimmicked trick can feel impromptu (and, when you think about it, most gimmicked tricks SHOULD feel that way) but that doesn't mean it is actually impromptu.
Again, just my two cents.
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RajeshLGov
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Posted: 02-16-2007 18:35 |
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| I strongly feel erlandish is right, thats how I define impromptu too. Best Wishes.
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gone
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Posted: 02-16-2007 20:08 |
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| I feel an impromtu effect is something you can do "on the spot". If you can create the gimmick you need on the spot then your gimmicked trick is impromptu. I aggree that a trick that needs a thumbtip should not be called impromptu. But you could possibly construct an impromptu version of that same effect that doesn't need the thumbtip. For example using a TT for a salt vanish you may be somewhere without your TT but you spot a small bottle that will do the trick. Now you can perform an impromptu version of your salt vanish effect. Of course that only means that that one time the effect was impromtu. Because you had everything you needed at hand. But in general you would not call the salt vanish an impromtu effect.
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mystery-mark
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Posted: 02-16-2007 21:16 |
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Very thanx for the great posts guys!
Well...one more example I want to have a bit more clear so hope you could help me out:
Let me say someone ask you to do a trick with their incomplete deck and they give you the permission of doing everything with the deck you want. You see a marker and with a little bit of misdirection you get the chance to give the deck a sidemark and then the spectator may choose a card any card, they sign the card with the same marker you just used and then you can locate the card after they putted it back theirselves etcetera. You created a gimmick because of the mark but it was impromptu, wasn't it?
Thanx again and hope you could help me out...
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gone
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Posted: 02-16-2007 23:46 |
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mystery-mark wrote:
Very thanx for the great posts guys!
Well...one more example I want to have a bit more clear so hope you could help me out:
Let me say someone ask you to do a trick with their incomplete deck and they give you the permission of doing everything with the deck you want. You see a marker and with a little bit of misdirection you get the chance to give the deck a sidemark and then the spectator may choose a card any card, they sign the card with the same marker you just used and then you can locate the card after they putted it back theirselves etcetera. You created a gimmick because of the mark but it was impromptu, wasn't it?
Thanx again and hope you could help me out...
At the time you performed it it was impromtu because everything was readily available to you. But you can't say its an impromtu effect because you won't always be that lucky to have everything available to you.
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